S05E25-26: The Cutie Re-Mark

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Re: S05E25-26: The Cutie Re-Mark

Postby Captain Rufus (?) » Mon Nov 30, 2015 7:36 pm

Bremen wrote:
I think I know what you mean. It may be less dystopian than the other futures, but it's also very un-pony, and I think that gives it a special feeling of loss.


It's "If Friendship is Witchcraft Wasn't Funny" basically. So if they won Rarity and Fluttershy would basically be attempting to summon Cthulhu to destroy everything because emotional pain. :fluttersmith:
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Postby PaulloDEC (?) » Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:22 pm

Mechanical Ape wrote:The Pony in the High Castle :equestria:


I agree that while the Sombraverse may be objectively better than most of the other timelines, it's somehow the saddest one. And I'm not sure I can articulate why. Surely one is better off fighting in a war, a war which is still winnable, than cocooned by changelings or tormented by a chaos god. But I dunno, something about the way everything is so gray and serious, that life goes on but nobody is living the life they're meant to have -- it's somehow a very powerful anti-war message, knowing how much better and brighter things could have been had there been peace.

Maybe it's the fact that Changeling World and Discord World are so clearly awful, but Sombra World is just functional enough that if you were living in it, you might not expect that life that could have been better. At least until a purple unicorn comes by and breaks the news. :(


Well said. I think that scene is particularly sad for Applejack too, given that she's one of the last ponies left living in Ponyville. A pre-war world should still be fresh in her memory (the war having only started, what, a year or two ago?), but now she works almost alone in a grey shadow of what used to be her home.

I initially couldn't quite put my finger on what her face reminded me of when Twi breaks the news, but I later realised it was like that moment when you realise you're crazy jealous of someone, and you have to look away because your jealously shames you.
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Postby Daring Do (?) » Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:27 pm

PaulloDEC wrote:Even with maybe-she's-dead-or-maybe-she-just-fell-over Fluttershy, this was still the saddest moment in the story for me:

Image

A beautifully understated moment.


Reminds me of a fancomic I saw on EQD the other day...

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Postby Headless Horse (?) » Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:35 pm

^^ Oh my god :lol:

Something tells me the reaction the fandom will have to this episode going all "let's do FO:E for reals" won't be to go even further down that path, but to come up with whole new angles to carom off in.
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Postby Sailor Yue (?) » Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:46 pm

Captain Rufus wrote:
It's "If Friendship is Witchcraft Wasn't Funny" basically. So if they won Rarity and Fluttershy would basically be attempting to summon Cthulhu to destroy everything because emotional pain. :fluttersmith:

I forgot they did a song about war....


Holy shit I forgot how TWISTED that song was. :gotcha:
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Postby SlateSlabrock (?) » Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:04 pm

The episodes aren't on iTunes yet. :grumpydash:
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Postby Mechanical Ape (?) » Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:20 pm

Because we get such limited glimpses of the alternate timelines, a lot of the detail of how they came about is left to interpretation. It's fun to see the course of history be so flexible and yet convergent in some ways. That sort of openness is also fertile ground for fan imagination, so we shouldn't be surprised by an explosion of fanfic to fill in the gaps.

For instance, although the ponies didn't get their cutie marks on Rainboom Day, they clearly got them somehow. And, when they are shown, they are the same cutie marks they normally have (which seems to imply that one's future mark is decided at birth). How and when did Pinkie Pie eventually discover her party potential, or Applejack come home from Manehattan? There's plenty of room to play around and speculate.

Or -- in most of the timelines, it is not eternal night, which means that the Nightmare Moon situation was defused, but we don't know how. Luna might have been re-imprisoned in some cases, redeemed in others, maybe even killed in others, who knows. (We see her being tormented by Discord, but nary a peep about her in the Sombra timeline.) But somehow Nightmare Moon was handled, and it's almost irresistible to want to get creative about how.

It's a lot more fun than if they'd gone with a more rigid causality model. Here, there are so many ways for things to go bad, all somehow relating to minor variations on R-Day.
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Postby Fizzbuzz (?) » Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:55 pm

Mechanical Ape wrote:The Pony in the High Castle :equestria:


I agree that while the Sombraverse may be objectively better than most of the other timelines, it's somehow the saddest one. And I'm not sure I can articulate why. Surely one is better off fighting in a war, a war which is still winnable, than cocooned by changelings or tormented by a chaos god. But I dunno, something about the way everything is so gray and serious, that life goes on but nobody is living the life they're meant to have -- it's somehow a very powerful anti-war message, knowing how much better and brighter things could have been had there been peace.

Maybe it's the fact that Changeling World and Discord World are so clearly awful, but Sombra World is just functional enough that if you were living in it, you might not expect that life that could have been better. At least until a purple unicorn comes by and breaks the news. :(

Consider that while most folks watching this show aren't going to remember a time when their country was at war with even the homeland visibly strained (thinking of WWII here, or the Vietnam War to an extent, with the draft as it was there), it's still something we know a lot about from our relatively recent history. Furthermore, considering Rainbow Dash in that world, I think plenty of us have at least seen war veterans who have lost a limb or are otherwise battle-scarred. Meanwhile, cases where a violent leader is stomping out a guerrilla resistance force or has achieved utter military dominion are nearly unknown to FiM's audience, and a world remade according to the whims of a chaos god or one where life has gone completely extinct are things that do not exist at all.

Since we can sympathize most with Sombra's world, that's why it hurts to see it.
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Postby Just Scuds (?) » Tue Dec 01, 2015 5:56 am

Image
:excite: :"Heyyyyyyy, if it isn't Rainbow Dash! How ya doing? Big fan!"
:bwuh: :"Uh, thanks. Wait, are you an ... alicorn?!"
Image
Image :"Haaa haa ha. No. Noooo! I'm just your plain old garden variety horned pegasus!"
:bwuh: :"Ahhhhhhh... I don't think I've ever heard of a- "
Image :"Well there's a first time for everything, Rainbow. Say you know what'd really make my day? If you did a Sonic Rainboom right about now. Just this second."
:v: :"Oh sure, like that'll happen. Know what'd make my day? If you grew a second head!"
:spoiler: :"I have the utmost faith that you could do it - "
Image
:excite: :"As a matter of fact, I've seen you do a Sonic Rainboom multiple times! In the future! In an alternate timeline!"
Image :"I like you! You're nuttier than a shithouse bat, but, I like you! Wanna give me some personal space so I don't get any of your crazy-germs on me?"

Image :"Spike! We're running out of time, we need a Sonic Rainboom right this instant!"
:yikes: :"The race is already over!"
:-I :"I am so sorry about this."
Image :"About wh-"

:no: :Aaaaaauggghhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaa...
Image

Image :"Oh! no! My baby dragon! Won't somepony save him?!"

Image

:spoiler: :"Now's your cue!"
Image :"He's plummeting to the earth! You'd have to fly really really fast to catch up to him! You might even break the sound barrier!"

:bwuh: :"I don't think you'd have dropped him if you didn't have a way of getting him back...."

:facehoof: :"Fine. Spike, get back here."

*FWOOSH*

Image
Image :"Ha-ha! Called my bluff, there! I've always known you to be pretty sharp in your own way, Rainbow. Let me tell you! Spike, let's find another approach..."
Image :"Gee, thanks! I'm calling the cops, now."

Image :"Life ... flashed ... before my eyes .... didn't take too long."
Image :"Fate of Equestria, Spike. Eyes on the prize. You know the routine by now."



Wishing I had a better source, but I like this little cycle
Image
In the Grim Darkness of Future Equestria There Are Only Unicycles :excellent:
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Postby Gnot Syndrome (?) » Tue Dec 01, 2015 6:42 am

Image

I like that at the end of the all the time traveling the map just says "fuck it, I'm taking this."

Damn ponies and their hacking-magic bullshit messing with my plans for world peace. :argh:
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Postby PaulloDEC (?) » Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:58 am

Gnot Syndrome wrote:Image

I like that at the end of the all the time traveling the map just says "fuck it, I'm taking this."

Damn ponies and their hacking-magic bullshit messing with my plans for world peace. :argh:


I thought it was interesting the way they drew attention to all that. I wonder where the scroll ended up?
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Postby MurdER_weapOn '78 (?) » Tue Dec 01, 2015 11:12 am

I think the Tree of Harmony intervened at that point to make sure the spell couldn't be abused anymore, a bit like when Zecora took away the Alicorn Amulet.
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Postby SlateSlabrock (?) » Tue Dec 01, 2015 11:59 am

PaulloDEC wrote:
I thought it was interesting the way they drew attention to all that. I wonder where the scroll ended up?

In Grogar's clutches. :evil:
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Postby Just Scuds (?) » Tue Dec 01, 2015 1:13 pm

Mechanical Ape wrote:The Pony in the High Castle :equestria:


I agree that while the Sombraverse may be objectively better than most of the other timelines, it's somehow the saddest one. And I'm not sure I can articulate why. Surely one is better off fighting in a war, a war which is still winnable, than cocooned by changelings or tormented by a chaos god. But I dunno, something about the way everything is so gray and serious, that life goes on but nobody is living the life they're meant to have -- it's somehow a very powerful anti-war message, knowing how much better and brighter things could have been had there been peace.

Maybe it's the fact that Changeling World and Discord World are so clearly awful, but Sombra World is just functional enough that if you were living in it, you might not expect that life that could have been better. At least until a purple unicorn comes by and breaks the news. :(


I'm guessing the other worlds are worse so they can conserve time, these double episodes always tend to feel like five pounds of mud in a three pound bag. Five seconds to make a point here means five seconds removed from there, and we have the hard limits of the ad breaks to work around.

Sombra world is awful because it represents a thing that actually happened in our world; a state of total war between countries where an entire economy is dedicated towards a long term effort is definitely something that happened during WW I in France and Germany. Sombra clearly can't be bargained with so he'll throw every thing he can into defeating Celestia, so the world they're living in kinda looks like if WW I was allowed to continue on for over a decade with no clear decisive wins, with years of ever tightening rationing on the home front; pretty damn bleak.


Thing is, timeline wise, AJ looks tired as hell, which means that they've been fighting for awhile which means the crystal empire had to have appeared earlier for whatever reason and the only thing that changed to set this off was the sonic rainboon. Oh well.


E: Fwiw, I probably shouldn't make ponies jerks for laughs in those emoticon posts. :-P
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Postby Headless Horse (?) » Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:35 pm

Scuderia Ferrarity wrote:Wishing I had a better source, but I like this little cycle
Image
In the Grim Darkness of Future Equestria There Are Only Unicycles :excellent:


I do like that run cycle on the princesses, especially Celestia. I don't think we've ever seen her cantering/galloping like that before, have we? It looks very convincingly equine. Someone did their homework.
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Postby Mechanical Ape (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:39 am

Image


Image "Well, at least I can study in peace, now that everypony's dead."



* * CRUNCH * *


Image "Noooooooo! It's not fair! There was time now! There was finally time!"
Image
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Postby Ransom (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:25 am

Mechanical Ape wrote:Image


Image "Well, at least I can study in peace, now that everypony's dead."



* * CRUNCH * *


Image "Noooooooo! It's not fair! There was time now! There was finally time!"


:golfclop: :golfclop: :golfclop: :golfclop:

Side note, it would have been funny if she had looked at the Flim Flam future, stopped and thought, 'Wait...I may actually be able to deal with this. Give me a minute.'
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Postby Just Scuds (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 7:33 am

^^^ :golfclop:


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Image :"Without this rainboom, I might not have gotten into magic school. Celestia wouldn't have taken me on as her pupil or sent me to Ponyville to meet my friends. And the most powerful thing about Cutie Mark Magic that I found is the connection I share with them."
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Image: :"But, um..."
Image :"Oh come on, you've practiced this until you turned purple..."
Image


Image
Image :" 'The real question about Cutie Mark Magic is who it seems to affect.' and so on."



Image

Image

Image

:whyme: :"What? Did you suddenly get stage fright in the middle of the speech?"

:sheepish: :"..........."

Image :"Ah... hey everypony, I know you've come to see one of this school's most famous magic graduates give a speech. But I have a confession to make - "

Image :"You're going off script? You never go off script!"

Image :"While I was a student here I spent day and night devouring everything there was to know about magic. But while the time spent learning all that paid off handsomely, I feel that my education only truly began when Princess Celestia effectively booted me out of my observatory and into the wider world, namely Ponyville."

Image :"Where are you going with this, Twilight? You've got to make this pay off somehow...."

Image :"All of you represent the best and brightest of the unicorns of Canterlot. And it would be a shame if we hid our light under a bushel by simply constraining our efforts to the study and advancement of magic. Travelling the world, I've been exposed to many arts and sciences that are the purview of pegasii and earth ponies alike. While we may be primarily focused on magic, the world awaits our contributions to the science of Agriculture, Business, Meteorology, Zoology, Food sciences ..."

:excite: :"And last but, certainly not least, Dentistry!"
Image :"....."
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Postby MurdER_weapOn '78 (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:43 am



This was the most brutal timeline, it looked like they were surveying the aftermath of a nuclear holocaust :cry:
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Postby The Doctor (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:05 pm

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Image

I loved this part. Spike hanging out with the old crew.
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Postby Wildfire (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:42 pm

MurdER_weapOn '78 wrote:
This was the most brutal timeline, it looked like they were surveying the aftermath of a nuclear holocaust :cry:


:wingsright: Don't call it a grave, it's the future you chose Starlight. It didn't have to end like this. Why didn't you listen?
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Postby Mechanical Ape (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:55 pm

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:shock: "Nightmare Moon is back and Rarity's working for her?! Spike, what timeline have we found ourselves in?"

:moonie: "A timeline, my little foals, in which only ponies voiced by Tabitha St. Germain have survived!"
:vogue: "Or as we call it -- The Best Timeline!"

Image "My Kveen, here are ze royal headshots you ordered."
:moonie: "Ah, marvelous. Tell Twinkleshine she did a good job with the lighting. And thank Suri for the hat."

:derp: "Message from Mrs. Cake, your majesty! She's found evidence of a traitor in our midst -- right here in our royal guard!"

:moonie: "But who could it be?"

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:awkward: "Uhhhhh .... heheheheheh."
:moonie:
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Postby Adelor Lyon (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:59 pm

MurdER_weapOn '78 wrote:
This was the most brutal timeline, it looked like they were surveying the aftermath of a nuclear holocaust :cry:

That was the one where Celestia turned into Nightmare Flare and burned the world to a crisp through eternal day.

The Nightmare Moon timeline is also interesting; one would wonder why Nightmare Moon would have all her guards except for Rainbow Dash be thestrals. (note the tufted ears on everyone except Dash in the distance shot)
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Postby Fizzbuzz (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 4:07 pm

Even then, Rainbow Dash still appears with bat wings. Perhaps the animators simply forgot to put the tufts of hair on her ears?
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Postby PonyHag714 (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 4:08 pm

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Dust in the wind...
All we are is dust in the wind...Image
:speakest: The fun has been doubled!
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Postby PictishBeast (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:45 pm

Mechanical Ape wrote:Image
:moonie: "A timeline, my little foals, in which only ponies voiced by Tabitha St. Germain have survived!"


:granny: "Well now, ain't that a hoot? Come on Moonie, we're havin' a hoedown!"
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Postby Headless Horse (?) » Wed Dec 02, 2015 7:11 pm

Fizzbuzz wrote:Even then, Rainbow Dash still appears with bat wings. Perhaps the animators simply forgot to put the tufts of hair on her ears?


:twonk: But that would just raise further questions!
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Postby Just Scuds (?) » Thu Dec 03, 2015 4:12 am

Image

Image :"Sunburst and I did everything together. In fact, I don't remember us ever being apart. Until today."

Image

Image

Image :"Could it be? ...."

Image

:excite: :"Oh my gosh! I don't believe it! It's a BOOK SHELVING cutie mark!"

Image WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU - I'M BARING MY SOUL HERE AND YOU'RE

Image :"Sorry, Twilight's kinda got a one-track-mind about stuff like that."
Image GAAAHHH!




Image
:awesomedash: :"Oh check it out check it out - you know that scene with Rarity? We can step through frame by frame..."
Image :"And you can actually pinpoint the instant his little heart rips in half."

Image

Image

Image

Image :"Aaaaaand .... NOW!"

Image
:no:
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Postby SlateSlabrock (?) » Thu Dec 03, 2015 9:17 am

Scuderia, you're a jewel. :lol:
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Postby PictishBeast (?) » Thu Dec 03, 2015 10:34 pm

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I really liked Rarity here. She's working for the villain and she's not acting particularly friendly towards Spike and Twilight, but it's not like she's "Evil Rarity."

I could totally see her doing something like this under the right circumstances.
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Postby Ransom (?) » Thu Dec 03, 2015 11:43 pm

That timeline, with Rarity and Dash working for Nightmare Moon, does actually raise some interesting questions. When she came back, did she choose Rarity to keep her palace looking fabulous and give Dash a role in her guard because she first appeared in Ponyville and her Castle was nearby (note she lives in the Castle of the Two Sisters, not Celestia's Canterlot castle)? Was that offer in the first episode to Dash basically on the level?

Also, it was sad, but in character how Dash and Rarity acted, like, ticked off and resigned to the situation. I mean hey, they probably had it better than 90% of the public.

Whether Dash was given bat wings by Nightmare Moon or those were decorative armor is...going to bug me way more than it should :v:
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Postby The Doctor (?) » Thu Dec 03, 2015 11:56 pm

Those are Luna's guards, so it seems like it would have made more sense to have Dash and the other guards be the Shadowbolts. :ponder:
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Postby Dexanth (?) » Fri Dec 04, 2015 12:11 am

Fizzbuzz wrote:Even then, Rainbow Dash still appears with bat wings. Perhaps the animators simply forgot to put the tufts of hair on her ears?


Or the bat wings are like her armor - coverings rather than actual.
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Postby The Doctor (?) » Fri Dec 04, 2015 12:15 am

Dexanth wrote:
Or the bat wings are like her armor - coverings rather than actual.


This is what I assumed they were. Kind of like Fluttershy's costume bat-wings in Scare Master
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Postby Ransom (?) » Fri Dec 04, 2015 12:20 am

The Doctor wrote:Those are Luna's guards, so it seems like it would have made more sense to have Dash and the other guards be the Shadowbolts. :ponder:

I was wondering about the Shadowbolts too, though it seems that she created the Shadowbolt shades specifically to appeal to Dash, remember, the original Wonderbolts weren't actually created until after Luna's banishment. My guess is that without the need to try and get Dash to abandon her friends, she had no reason to bribe her with a fake version of her dream. Which is kindof sad to think about.
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Postby UnintelGen (?) » Fri Dec 04, 2015 5:42 am

Ransom wrote:Also, it was sad, but in character how Dash and Rarity acted, like, ticked off and resigned to the situation. I mean hey, they probably had it better than 90% of the public.


I didn't really see Dash as "ticked off", more just really sucking up to the new empress boss lady. Considering she is the only one without the ear thing-ies I like to think she's a more recent recruit and is trying to rise above the ranks.

:seethe: "...Or you'll go to the dungeon!"

:v: "Man, if I don't get those ears soon..."

She's also the one (of two) to chase Twilight when she escapes. I think that was a nice touch.
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Postby Just Scuds (?) » Fri Dec 04, 2015 6:10 am

Ransom wrote:That timeline, with Rarity and Dash working for Nightmare Moon, does actually raise some interesting questions. When she came back, did she choose Rarity to keep her palace looking fabulous and give Dash a role in her guard because she first appeared in Ponyville and her Castle was nearby (note she lives in the Castle of the Two Sisters, not Celestia's Canterlot castle)? Was that offer in the first episode to Dash basically on the level?



Just playing around ...
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Image :"Eh, alright. Name's Applejack, my family's been growin' apples for generations."

Image :"There shall be precious little light for growing apples. What can you grow in darkness, farmer?"

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Image :"I like your spirit. Welcome to the Royal Guard. Next!"

Image

Image *eek*

Image :"Cheese Mines. Next!"
Image
Image
Image :"Meh, it's probably not so bad - get to work in a cheese mine, mining cheese, in a mine."
Image :"AAAAUUUUUGHHHHWWAAAAA"

:vogue: :"I am Rarity, owner and operator Carousel Boutique, purveyor of the finest haute couture to Canterlot's best dressed-"

Image :"And where do you think they are?"

Image :"Cheeee..."
Image :"WELL! Your highness, if I may so bold so as to draw your attention to the condition of the castle we are sitting in."
Image :"Simply crumbling to pieces from the weight of what must clearly be millennia of neglect!"
:cry: :"Viewing these tapestries alone in their unrestored state hurts me to the core, so please, for the sake of all that is beautiful in this wondrous eternal night of ours, let me bring them back to their former glory!"
:eyebrow: :"Laying it on a little thick there..."

Image :"Very well. Prove yourself. Don't disappoint me."

~Later~

:vogue: :"Et Voila! Fully restored neo-classical tapestries rewoven with fibres dyed with the juice of darkest nightshade, and inlaid with obsidian and sapphire!"

Image :"Congratulations. You are now head of castle decor. Next!"

Image :"Oooooh! Thank you-thank you-thank you! You won't regret it! If these walls could speak, they would be singing of your glorious return of your Royal Highness ... "
Image :"And of the marvelous wall decorations!"

Image :"Tear these tapestries down, they remind me of my sister. How soon can you make new ones?"
Image :"F-f-f-five - five days..."

Image :"I expect new ones in three. Get to it!"

...

Image

...

Image :"Who does she think she is, rushing me like that?"
Image :"Ungrateful Nightmare Moon..."
Image :"Not to mention what an ungrateful cahstle!"
Just Scuds
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Oh, I love trash!
Anything dirty or dingy or dusty
Anything ragged or rotten or rusty
Yes, I - love - traaaaash!
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Postby Headless Horse (?) » Fri Dec 04, 2015 11:30 am

I'd friggin watch that.
Headless Horse
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The pumpkin is strictly ornamental
Faithful Students
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Postby PictishBeast (?) » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:33 pm

That was amazing.
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Character Select: Winter Nickel
Abilities: Cynicism lv1, Ennui lv1
Inventory: Turnip
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Gender: Male

Postby Adelor Lyon (?) » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:36 pm

UnintelGen wrote:
I didn't really see Dash as "ticked off", more just really sucking up to the new empress boss lady. Considering she is the only one without the ear thing-ies I like to think she's a more recent recruit and is trying to rise above the ranks.

:offendash: "I'll always be loyal to the princess!" she said in S2E1.

Replace princess with queen and perhaps this turn isn't too terribly out of character for Dash. One could hypothesize having her five friends around her mellowed her out quite a bit (remember, in S1E5 she stated she didn't even hang out with Pinkie, and in S1E13, Dash's first focus episode, she was super competitive with Applejack). Since she didn't have Twilight's influence to make friends she probably kept her rough edge later in life, didn't have that group of friends to be loyal to (S1E2), and cast her loyalty elsewhere.

Alternate history is fun! :awesomedash:
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Location: Chicago, IL

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