S05E04: Bloom and Gloom

Episode, movie, and comic book discussion threads are kept here once they have been released.

Moderators: Perrydotto, Dexanth, Venusy, Wayoshi

Re: S05E04: Bloom and Gloom

Postby Aurora (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:28 pm

I was kind of surprised the "shadow" wasn't Starlight Glimmer
Image Image
Aurora
User avatar
nyaa
Rainbow Racers
Joined: May 17, 2011
Gender: Female

Postby Wayoshi (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:36 pm

I liked this episode decently enough, but a good chunk of the middle was dull.

I kinda have a bias against dream sequence eps – a lot of the content just ends up being of no consequence, which is what Acts I-II end up being, for the most part. Do the acts develop the themes of the ep well? Absolutely. But there's still some of an empty feeling that nothing we see for quite awhile is that real, at least for me. Hell, I was kinda convinced that the Twittermite cutie mark could have been real – AB would have helping Apples Bloom indirectly, after all. But I guess random old pony stalking around looking to pass his career on was kinda too lolrandom to be real. :-P But that was a good five minutes of the episode dedicated to a pretty involved setup, maybe too involved for just a dream.

I didn't care for Scoots/Sweetie acting like DT/SS for a bit, either. In terms of AB's characterization, it was perfect - AB would dream exactly this as a representation of her insecurities. It just wasn't very interesting to watch. Similar reactions to AJ & family rejecting her – Big Mac talking / role reversal and all that are gags that have been used before and fell a bit flat on repeat.

On the other hand, using Babs Seed as the setup for the conflict was smart, although she has pretty much been written out of the show now for good. As mentioned already, the lullaby was great, and I really liked the twist that AB's insecurities were portrayed even further by her own shadow, literally. More of Luna's dream realm and how she hops around everyone's dreams was welcomed, too.

In conclusion, I rate the episode one sad dream Rarity out of two dream popular semi-fanon musical ponies.

Image
Wayoshi
User avatar
Paper Fluttershy
Stare Masters
Joined: Oct 26, 2011
Location: Boston, MA
Gender: Male

Postby ROBOT B9 (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:39 pm

I was actually pretty sure that the shadow was Starlight as well, until I realised that she couldn't distort reality like that and the voice changer seemed off.
:plonk: Image :)
ROBOT B9
User avatar
Round and round and round she goes, where she'll stop, nobody knows :pinkietoot:
Semper Pie
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Location: Albir, Spain
Gender: Male

Postby Mr. Big (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:41 pm

I'm actually wondering if we'll ever see Babs Seed again with her cutie mark.
Mr. Big
User avatar
Feeling witchy, aren't we?
Scootaloo's Pro Scooters
Joined: Mar 27, 2011
Location: TN
Gender: Male

Postby Master_Twig (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:44 pm

This episode had a preview that included the bit where Sweetie Belle went on stage and had Octavia and Vinyl Scratch as judges. This would be the first time you ever see them together canonically. But... dream sequence, so it doesn't count. (Have they been together in the comics? I haven't read them.)

Still, though I did like the sequence where the family was tearing her down for having a mark without an apple, the rest of the episode was just kind of bland to me. I thought it was a bit too predictable and I just don't care about Applebloom's obsession with her mark. I thought Luna was rather flat and felt like Tabitha was really phoning it in. Luna just lacked any kind of real presence. The whole dream master thing worked a lot better for her in Sleepless in Ponyville, and to a lesser extent in For Whole the Sweetie Belle Toils.
Master_Twig
User avatar
Hey look, a bee.
Joined: Feb 18, 2011

Postby Fizzbuzz (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:49 pm

Bakertoons wrote:I'm actually wondering if we'll ever see Babs Seed again with her cutie mark.
She's already made two notable appearances in the comics, so if not in the show then I'm sure we'll at least see her again in print.

In fact, in light of her cutie mark, the way Friends Forever #13 ended is really nuts now. After Rarity and Babs Seed attend a roller derby match...
Image
Image

I don't think this was intentional, but I really, really want to believe it was. :wat:
Image
Fizzbuzz
User avatar
Stare Masters
Joined: Mar 02, 2013
Location: TN
Gender: Male

Postby Octavia (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 4:58 pm

Fizzbuzz wrote:I don't think this was intentional, but I really, really want to believe it was. :wat:

I'm sure it was intentional. The comic writers need to know what's going to happen in future episodes to keep continuity.

I thought the episode was really cute. Dream episodes in general are kinda meh, and it was obvious the whole time she was dreaming, but I like how all 3 of the CMC have now been visited by Luna. :speakest:

I was disappointed to find out the clip of Sweetie Belle on stage from the teaser trailer was part of a dream, though. :ohrarity:
Octavia
User avatar
Octavia's Orchestra
Joined: Sep 17, 2011
Location: Chicago, IL
Gender: Male

Postby Just Scuds (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:05 pm

Image
:annoyed: :"Now I know I'm still in a dream!"
:-P :"You sure about that?"
:gah: :"... no ..."
Just Scuds
User avatar
Did you know?

Every little thing you'd learn pushes another thing you'd learned out of your head, so Think Twice before you pick up that book.
Fashion Queens
Joined: Feb 14, 2011

Postby ROBOT B9 (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:13 pm

I was too, to be honest. I was hoping that it'd be a full episode because I thought it'd be a neat way to show off her singing talent. Oh well, what might have been... :v:
:plonk: Image :)
ROBOT B9
User avatar
Round and round and round she goes, where she'll stop, nobody knows :pinkietoot:
Semper Pie
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Location: Albir, Spain
Gender: Male

Postby Wayoshi (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:13 pm

Bakertoons wrote:Anyone got the parasprite reference? The pest control pony even said "Anyone with a trombone can get rid of parasprites!" :smirk:

OK, this is pretty good.
Wayoshi
User avatar
Paper Fluttershy
Stare Masters
Joined: Oct 26, 2011
Location: Boston, MA
Gender: Male

Postby Mr. Big (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:14 pm

Anyone notice that Scootaloo started flying around after she realized she's still in a dream? :lol: :nngh:
Mr. Big
User avatar
Feeling witchy, aren't we?
Scootaloo's Pro Scooters
Joined: Mar 27, 2011
Location: TN
Gender: Male

Postby The Doctor (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:16 pm

Fizzbuzz wrote:She's already made two notable appearances in the comics, so if not in the show then I'm sure we'll at least see her again in print.

In fact, in light of her cutie mark, the way Friends Forever #13 ended is really nuts now. After Rarity and Babs Seed attend a roller derby match...
Image
Image

I don't think this was intentional, but I really, really want to believe it was. :wat:



Image
Image

:starity: they knew....
The Doctor
User avatar
Turner of all things timey wimey
Celestia's Champions
Joined: May 05, 2011
Location: Time & Space
Gender: Male

Postby Wayoshi (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:18 pm

Fizzbuzz wrote:[FF13 continuity]

Cool shit if they did link this up intentionally. Some felt like Babs' talent revealed here was kinda out of nowhere, but she was malleable enough that I think anything was fine.

Image

I mean, her name was made specifically for One Bad Apple a pun on "bad seed", so linking a cutie mark to the name was basically impossible. Taking her quirky character trait into consideration for the mark was a better path. It's very possible FF13 just took off with this trait also and it's a coincidence.
Wayoshi
User avatar
Paper Fluttershy
Stare Masters
Joined: Oct 26, 2011
Location: Boston, MA
Gender: Male

Postby Marimo (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:45 pm

Based on his Twitter, it seems Whitley had some foreknowledge when writing FF#13.
https://twitter.com/jrome58/status/589556040531869696
Marimo
User avatar
Ultimate Poster
Faithful Students
Joined: Dec 12, 2012
Gender: Male

Postby ROBOT B9 (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:49 pm

That little letter makes me wonder...are cutie marks also used as some sort of signature?
:plonk: Image :)
ROBOT B9
User avatar
Round and round and round she goes, where she'll stop, nobody knows :pinkietoot:
Semper Pie
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Location: Albir, Spain
Gender: Male

Postby LardLad3545 (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 6:05 pm

Aurora wrote:I was kind of surprised the "shadow" wasn't Starlight Glimmer

I try my best not to do this, but I'll be honest, I was right next door to certain that it was Starlight Glimmer. I don't know if I'd call what I felt disappointment, but... eh, maybe it was. One of my greatest desires of the show so far is the addition of lots of continuity, possibly even full on serialization. Nonetheless, it was just me slipping up in controlling expectations.

Anywho, liked the episode. Started off actually really not liking where I saw it going after the first third, but it didn't go there, so we're good. Also, did anyone else love the little motion Luna made when AppleBloom called the dream meeting of the Cutie Mark Crusaders to order and then hit the *honkey honkey* sounding block with her hoof gavel?

Image

So... cute... Also this :smirk:
LardLad3545
User avatar
Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.
Joined: Dec 28, 2012
Location: Springfield, MO
Gender: Male

Postby Fizzbuzz (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 6:05 pm

ROBOT B9 wrote:That little letter makes me wonder...are cutie marks also used as some sort of signature?

I doubt it applies quite so much here (since one, she signed her name, and two, I'm sure she wanted the others to see what it actually looked like), but we have seen other cases of ponies using designs from their cutie marks in personalized stuff. Consider the saddlebags that we've seen the Mane Six using many times through the series. Their buckles all have different decorations; as seen in Dragonshy, for example:
Image

Marimo wrote:Based on his Twitter, it seems Whitley had some foreknowledge when writing FF#13.
https://twitter.com/jrome58/status/589556040531869696

Huh. Damn, that was subtle.
Image
Fizzbuzz
User avatar
Stare Masters
Joined: Mar 02, 2013
Location: TN
Gender: Male

Postby kidcoelacanth (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 6:08 pm

I liked when Scootaloo and Sweetie Belle finally cut off the dead weight that is Apple Bloom
"Oh boy!"
/
ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ - - - Image
ImageImageImage
ImageImageImageImage
kidcoelacanth
User avatar
hug life chose me
Princesses of Soul
Joined: Jul 27, 2011
Location: Baltimore
Gender: Male

Postby Factory Factory (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 7:14 pm

Image

Applebloom literally has an apple-shaped bone in her torso.
There is no guarantee that the wizard selling you that bag full of magic sand is wearing pants underneath his robes.
Factory Factory
User avatar
ponkin' pie
Semper Pie
Joined: Nov 07, 2011
Location: Horsedale, NY
Gender: Male

Postby Dexanth (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 7:22 pm

Wayoshi wrote:Cool shit if they did link this up intentionally. Some felt like Babs' talent revealed here was kinda out of nowhere, but she was malleable enough that I think anything was fine.

Image

I mean, her name was made specifically for One Bad Apple a pun on "bad seed", so linking a cutie mark to the name was basically impossible. Taking her quirky character trait into consideration for the mark was a better path. It's very possible FF13 just took off with this trait also and it's a coincidence.


The little apple seeds/leaf in her mark are a nice touch
:milkshake: Image ImageImage Image
Dexanth
User avatar
Love conquers all
Celestia's Champions
Joined: Oct 23, 2011
Gender: Female

Postby Killing Vector (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 7:23 pm

Wayoshi wrote:Image

Notice that the handles on the scissors resemble an apple cut in half, complete with black dots where the seeds would go. I thought that was a nice touch.

Preview edit: bah, sniped.
ImageImageImageImage
Killing Vector
User avatar
Faithful Students
Joined: May 23, 2011
Gender: Male

Postby Fizzbuzz (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 7:32 pm

Factory Factory wrote:Image

Applebloom literally has an apple-shaped bone in her torso.

She and her family are apples to the core :v:
Image
Fizzbuzz
User avatar
Stare Masters
Joined: Mar 02, 2013
Location: TN
Gender: Male

Postby Discord (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 7:36 pm

What happens if an Apple's destiny is to be an orange farmer?

HOW WILL YOU APPLEFY THAT?! :twonk:
Discord
User avatar
Agents of Chaos
Joined: Dec 11, 2011
Gender: Male

Postby ROBOT B9 (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 7:52 pm

She could be a botanist, combining the two fruits. :-P
:plonk: Image :)
ROBOT B9
User avatar
Round and round and round she goes, where she'll stop, nobody knows :pinkietoot:
Semper Pie
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Location: Albir, Spain
Gender: Male

Postby Marimo (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:13 pm

Discord wrote:What happens if an Apple's destiny is to be an orange farmer?

HOW WILL YOU APPLEFY THAT?! :twonk:

Image
Marimo
User avatar
Ultimate Poster
Faithful Students
Joined: Dec 12, 2012
Gender: Male

Postby acksed (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:19 pm

:rainbert: "Rarity, you look ridiculous."
:vogue: "I'm going to ignore that comment out of a desire to help you."
acksed
User avatar
I'm mad, I'm mad, I'm reallyreallyreally mad
Joined: Nov 25, 2013
Gender: Male

Postby WandereringPony (?) » Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:37 pm

Bakertoons wrote:Speaking of pancakes, anyone notice that the breakfast got weirder and weirder as the dreams went on? In the last one, Applejack was serving CAKE, with a punch bowl full of live fish. Oh, and there's a jar of dog biscuits on the side.

Image


Yep, they really had fun with the dreamscape bits- the gradually going surreal backgrounds, voices, and so on. There was stuff like Pinkie-rooster that I missed completely on the first go-round for the episode, or the more subtle "it's a rooster, how did it lay an egg"?

And it was a nice touch at the end with Scootaloo, who of the three seems to have had the most motivation to practice lucid dreaming for some literal "air time".
WandereringPony
Joined: Mar 23, 2013
Gender: Male

Postby Homeswirl (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 10:51 am

Oh man, I loved this episode. It captured that weird dream non-logic so well.

I burst out laughing at the dopey dolphin cutie mark, especially after its dramatic reveal. I love this show. :-D

It covered a lot of fan speculation very well, but it is a bit disappointing that it didn't commit to any change to the status quo for the CMC (but yay for Babs!), and that the dream shadow wasn't related to eps 1-2. But I am very glad that they didn't leave the "It was just a dream!" for the end.

This episode was just a whole heap of empathetic fun.
Homeswirl
User avatar
Joined: Nov 26, 2013

Postby SlateSlabrock (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 11:22 am

It looks like we're in for another season of Wilhelm screams.

Image
SlateSlabrock
User avatar
The information's unavailable to the mortal man.
Celestia's Champions
Joined: Feb 14, 2011

Postby ROBOT B9 (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:18 pm

Maybe it was the audio mixing but I didn't hear the scream the first time I watched it. :pinkieshrug:
:plonk: Image :)
ROBOT B9
User avatar
Round and round and round she goes, where she'll stop, nobody knows :pinkietoot:
Semper Pie
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Location: Albir, Spain
Gender: Male

Postby Fizzbuzz (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:29 pm

Me neither. Whenever I watch this episode again I'll have to listen closely, but if it was there then it definitely didn't stand out like it did a few times in S4.
Image
Fizzbuzz
User avatar
Stare Masters
Joined: Mar 02, 2013
Location: TN
Gender: Male

Postby Angel Beat (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:48 pm

This episode won me over with AJ's lullaby. :allears:

Did think Princess Luna sounded off though.


Edit: That's what ya get for phoneposting. :bluh:
Last edited by Angel Beat on Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ImageImage
Avatar by Karzahnii, image used with permission.
Angel Beat
User avatar
~Thanks for the love!~
Rarity's Roughnecks
Joined: Jul 11, 2013
Location: Harlingen, the Netherlands
Gender: Male

Postby PonyHag714 (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:07 pm

I liked the bit of a callback to Ponyville Condiential when Mac gave the big speech and AJ did the "eeyup". :eeyup:
:speakest: The fun has been doubled!
PonyHag714
User avatar
Trick or treat, smell my feet
Joined: Mar 18, 2013
Location: Oromareocto, Canterda
Gender: Male

Postby Headless Horse (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:06 pm

You guys this episode was intense as shit :flail:

And the generally lukewarm reception is kinda baffling. I thought it was an outstanding piece of writing from Josh Haber, that took on a whole lot of open questions that we as fans have been speculating on for months/years and both answered them substantively and created new avenues for exploration.

Most significantly, it took the "obvious" upcoming Apple Bloom/Luna/dream episode we were all expecting and turned it all sideways by making it more about cutie marks (AB's particular source of anxiety) than about their individual strengths and their relationships with their big sisters/mentors as Sweetie Belle's and Scootaloo's were; and not just that, but making it a group dream episode on top of everything else. It feels like SB and Scoots are kind of ahead of the curve in a way, like AB is only just now catching up with her friends, even though they're all "behind" in another way. :smirk:

I particularly liked Luna's "We've all had a lot on our minds tonight" thing, or "It's been a busy night for all of us" or however she worded it. It felt like she was wrangling together a whole shared dreamscape that even she could barely control; kind of like Mrs. Whatsit in A Wrinkle In Time (to neatly follow up with Camazotz from the season premiere).

But then there's this whole laundry list of things it did that we were all idly wondering whether or how the show would address:

1) Cutie marks as a literal life sentence to a job you might potentially hate:

Image

Which the show has now basically torpedoed as the pepperoni nightmare of a neurotic teen. Some ponies do get to make a living doing what they're great at, but others (like, say, Double Diamond) just make a hobby of it. And even if they do find themselves stuck with a cutie mark that they can work with, but that makes them the target of social classism (DT/SS' refreshed mockery), they can overcome it and/or prove their worth by being the one the town has to count on when they're in need of your talents.

2) Getting a cutie mark before your friends and having them treat you differently just because you beat them to the punch and/or don't share something in common with them anymore.

3) Getting a cutie mark that makes you different from your family/friends. Getting ostracized by your loved ones for, er, "coming out". Holy hell, I wonder if that's the specific angle they were going for, because that's pretty dang audacious if so. And the way they handled it was excellent, with the disorienting voice/line swapping and all the passive-aggressiveness and variety of reactions from family members ranging from disappointment to sarcasm to fury—but then dissipating it all with a reiteration that a family like Applejack's will love you no matter what you get.

4) Even—even—the Babs Seed thing felt very well handled. Someone might say it seems anticlimactic to have her cutie mark reveal happen off-screen and in such an offhand way; but I think that's pure realism at work. That's exactly how it would happen in real life. It would be a distant thing that would happen at an unexpected time, not during some kind of convenient reunion or something, and Babs would share it primarily with her local friends and only think to mention it to the CMCs as an afterthought.

Incidentally, I loved this Luna pose:

Image

"Babs Seed... ohhhhh yeah. Her. Nnnhey."

(Luna's voice sounded fine to me; but Michelle Creber is definitely getting older.)

And on top of all this, the episode basically told us right to our faces what Sweetie Belle and Scootaloo's cutie marks are going to be (and AB's too, for that matter, since they covered potion making as the "right" result). Which says to me that they're not putting any more stock in making the grand reveal a surprise, unless it's to do something completely non-traditional in the end like having them all get the same cutie mark, or having them never get it at all no matter how long the show lasts. With as much ground as this episode covered, and as many unusual directions it took, I'm fully expecting the CMCs' final cutie mark arc to end up somewhere we won't see coming at all.

In general there's just a ton of great texture and flourishes, like all the changing background details during the breakfast, the Pinkie rooster, and that smirk on Luna's face after the call-to-order bell goes HONK HONK. And that bit with Scootaloo going "Oh, we're still dreaming? Cool! *flies around* " —that right there is a really dark and poignant idea, and the writing is telling us right there that it knows all the implications and how much weight they carry... but they rolled it into a joke anyway. That's skillful and brave, and funny to boot. It just leaves you blinking if you think about it too hard. That's the kind of writing I really love to see, and Josh Haber is really bringing the game.

Pretty high-shelf stuff if you ask me.
Headless Horse
User avatar
The yoke is strictly ornamental
Faithful Students
Joined: May 23, 2011

Postby Fizzbuzz (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:15 pm

Headless Horse wrote:2) Getting a cutie mark before your friends and having them treat you differently just because you beat them to the punch and/or don't share something in common with them anymore.

This is something I'd wanted the show to address for a long time. After all, Apple Bloom first dealt with this way back in Call of the Cutie, with how she felt abandoned by Twist (even though Twist hadn't voluntarily done anything) and how her lack of a mark caused her to bond with Scootaloo and Sweetie Belle. Part of me does wish that it had been handled in an episode that wasn't almost entirely a dream sequence, but what we got here (especially in that ending scene with Luna and all three of the Crusaders) was still good.
Image
Fizzbuzz
User avatar
Stare Masters
Joined: Mar 02, 2013
Location: TN
Gender: Male

Postby Mechanical Ape (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:30 pm

ROBOT B9 wrote:I was actually pretty sure that the shadow was Starlight as well, until I realised that she couldn't distort reality like that and the voice changer seemed off.

I didn't see Shadow credited at the end; was it, in fact, Michelle Creber?

Factory Factory wrote:Image

Applebloom literally has an apple-shaped bone in her torso.

I love the pony cartoon because it makes me say things like "Wow, the crew really went all out on the skeletons this time."
Image
Mechanical Ape
User avatar
Halloween candy is like a mother's patience: it's never quite all gone.
Rarity's Roughnecks
Joined: Sep 24, 2011
Gender: Male

Postby Angel Beat (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:32 pm

Strange, not once did I get a Starlight vibe. :ponder:

Aside from the dream angle, when the shadow was saying "if that's your wish", I was thinking some sort of genie.

That, or Luna was being a mischievous moonbutt. :v:
ImageImage
Avatar by Karzahnii, image used with permission.
Angel Beat
User avatar
~Thanks for the love!~
Rarity's Roughnecks
Joined: Jul 11, 2013
Location: Harlingen, the Netherlands
Gender: Male

Postby Applepie (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:53 pm

At last Babs got her cutie mark. :yay:
Pinkie Pie: So, you see this here? This, um, this is um, a big, round room. It's known for its roundness, and bigness, and did I mention that it's round?
Applepie
User avatar
Mr. the Dragon
Joined: Jun 18, 2012
Location: Yakyakistan
Gender: Male

Postby The Outlander (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 4:48 pm

We continue the trend of intense-as-shit emotionally heavy episodes that touch on ranging philosophies and feelings. A+ Ponies, more Season 5 please.
Kate wrote:there are as many female characters in the base game as there are Cole McGraths
The Outlander
User avatar
Oh Barry~
Rarity's Roughnecks
Joined: Oct 21, 2012
Location: Bradford, PA

Postby ROBOT B9 (?) » Mon Apr 20, 2015 4:50 pm

Yeah, the way things have been building up, I hope that they continue this awesome streak throughout this season. Seems like they have some good stuff there.
:plonk: Image :)
ROBOT B9
User avatar
Round and round and round she goes, where she'll stop, nobody knows :pinkietoot:
Semper Pie
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Location: Albir, Spain
Gender: Male

Previous Next

Return to Pony Media Release Threads

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest